Pullin' It Up

Submitted: Monday, Jul 07, 2003 at 06:34
ThreadID: 120008 Views:1943 Replies:11 FollowUps:0
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OK, here I go again. Has anyone given any serious thought to hydraulic Disc Brakes on the 'Tracker. BT certainly don't like the idea, but then again, they don't think much of weight distribution hitches either. Grain of Salt Time Griff
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Reply By: Noosa Fox - Monday, Jul 07, 2003 at 06:36

Monday, Jul 07, 2003 at 06:36
I find that the 12" electrics work really good especially with the Techoncha Prodigy controller, so I would even consider anything else. I belive that Jumbo jets have been relying on electric brakes for years, so if they will sop a Jumbo they should stop a van OK. Brian
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Reply By: Deleted User - Monday, Jul 07, 2003 at 06:37

Monday, Jul 07, 2003 at 06:37
Griff, Are these the over-ride Titan system from Bainbridge ? Other than the normal maintenance for brake fluid systems (hygroscopic) the only down falls I can see would be cost and maybe a bit of clunking inherent in over-rides. The other really important thing with electric brakes is you can operate them independently of the vehicle ...... and a little sway correction, turbulence correction to stretch the rig when being over taken or even applying a little brake on a wet incline to keep the BT honest ! I've even used the manual over-ride as a handbrake .... Anthony
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Reply By: Deleted User - Monday, Jul 07, 2003 at 06:38

Monday, Jul 07, 2003 at 06:38
Thanks, Anthony. Almost right - Bainbridge/Titan. But not over-ride. Electrics are the same as for drums up to the point of the electric powered Hydraulic Actuator/Controller in the van. From that point on you have a 1200 PSI hydraulic system with progressive contol (courtesy of the Tekonsha in cab & the electronics in the actuator). They either have now, or are in developement, progressive take-up with left bias on Breakaway System (good if it happens on a left-hand bend & you happen to be the car coming the other way), as well as a fully developed ABS system (awaiting ADR's). 12" ventilated discs with single caliper (all in steel) have been suggested by Titan. Still researching Griff
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Reply By: Deleted User - Monday, Jul 07, 2003 at 06:39

Monday, Jul 07, 2003 at 06:39
Griff, I have done about 20,000km in my BT (probably not as much as all you other lucky people), and have found the 12"" electric brakes to have heaps of power. With a little bit of extra "power" setting on the controller, I can hold the van and the car nicely on steep descents using the manual over-ride, while keeping the car brakes in reserve. Oh yeah, and after 20,000km the pads are only about 15-20% worn. So, not quite sure why you would want to go to the extra trouble? And I suspect that adding some hydraulic componentry increases the risk of a leak or stone damage at some stage?
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Reply By: Deleted User - Monday, Jul 07, 2003 at 06:40

Monday, Jul 07, 2003 at 06:40
Griff, The $5000 installed worries me !!! (wow) The electro/hyd pumpy thingy is $1800 alone ? The only other slight niggle I have is the 1200psi divided by area of the pistons in sq ins (8of) equals pressure applied to the brake pad in psi. Is 1200 enough ? I thought modern systems ran over 2000psi in a car weighing 1600kg ? Maybe they have small pistons in the calipers. ? The wear rate of the pads pulling up 3000kg would be a clue .... better men than us have designed them .... I can remember an article somewhere with these brakes fitted to a Boroma van ? Chuck out what I said about elec operating separately being an advantage as these obviously do the same. Cost/repairable in the bush/servicing ......left ? Regards Anthony
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Reply By: Deleted User - Monday, Jul 07, 2003 at 06:41

Monday, Jul 07, 2003 at 06:41
Thanks all for the experiences. I certainly agree with you Noosa & Flip - the drums have plenty of stopping power - Simplicity quotes something over 5 tonnes combined! Don't know what system you're quoting Anthony (maybe the full Stainless calipers & rotors?) but the setup I'm toying with would come in at a bit under half what you quote, less the cost of the drum brakes. Agree the PSI figure looks a little low (although they quote 1500 PSI on their specs, the performance graph reads 1200). Awaiting direct comparison specs on stopping power etc. I'm quite comfortable to end up with the drums, but I do want to fully explore it. I have some experience in the marine environment where most heavy boat trailers have been using discs for years. I see the risk of leaks and line breakages in a correctly routed hydo line as about the same as a ripped wiring haness or shorts to the chassis in a fully electric system. I guess the bottom line is I've always felt discs to be inherently superior on all sorts of fronts & the drums feel a little Austin A40 to me. I'm sure I'll get over it though. Thanks Griff
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Reply By: Deleted User - Monday, Jul 07, 2003 at 06:42

Monday, Jul 07, 2003 at 06:42
Griff, Yep ! I think the discs were allybronzestainysteelythings ..... hence the price ! I agree re: the Fred Flinstone Drums but they work .... I love the way the drum and hub are cast as one. You gotta love that for bearing adjustment .... shoe inspection. I love my discs also ..... 350mm laser slotted Brembo discs 6 spot Brembo Calipers EBC 600deg c pads ..... X-mas is coming !! [wink] Here is an idea outta left field .... I'm looking at fitting a odometer to a wheel on BT to record distance .... the ones they fit to triaxle trailers. Although if I take my shoes off I can count the k's mine does using feet and hands. As a side note ..... talk about user pays ... in NZ trailers pay rego on distance travelled so are all fitted with these odometers that are tamperproof. A public servant could be promoted if he suggested that here !!! SSSShhhhhhhhhhhh !!!! [grin] Anthony
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Reply By: Deleted User - Monday, Jul 07, 2003 at 06:43

Monday, Jul 07, 2003 at 06:43
What do you mean my odometer isn't working? It was fine last time I checked it officer! It's been smashed in by a rock? The Devil you say! Well that could be - the Gibber Plain I came across last week was throwing up some rather large pieces, or it could have been that tricky creek crossing yesterday. How far have I travelled since last year? Well only the 600ks to get from home to here. Of course thats only an estimate. Log book? Nah, lost it in the creek. Sorry. Yes, I guess that will have to do as an estimate then. Thank you, officer, you've been most helpful.
AnswerID: 559109

Reply By: Noosa Fox - Monday, Jul 07, 2003 at 06:44

Monday, Jul 07, 2003 at 06:44
One advantage of having the Prodegy type brake controller, it is digital and when the trailer is connected correctly there is a letter "C" to tell you that the circuit is complete and I believe a "nc" when it is connected but not correctly. As for how far the BT has travelled, I keep a log book/diary in the van where I record every time the van is used, even if it is just down to BT and back (80Km) to get something done. I also record any damage or repairs/ additions that we have and where we are camped or travelled from and to. In the 2 years we have had it we have travelled just over 52,000km.
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Reply By: Deleted User - Monday, Jul 07, 2003 at 06:45

Monday, Jul 07, 2003 at 06:45
Brian wrote ... "In the 2 years we have had it we have travelled just over 52,000km." Only in a Bushtracker .... !! Brian, you must qualify for the most use of a BT in a 2 year period. Once over 50,000k you must qualify as an "Elder" ..... Can you lend me a few of your k's so I can qualify as a "new user" which is just up from a "new owner" [wink] Sheesh !!! 50k .... That would take me 10 years plus. Anthony
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Reply By: Deleted User - Monday, Jul 07, 2003 at 06:46

Monday, Jul 07, 2003 at 06:46
Noosa's right about the Prodigy - its one piece of gear. The other thing I REALLY like about it is the proportional breaking in reverse - unendingly helpful when trying to back a large twin stern-drive down a slimy boat ramp. I'm sure there will be the odd moment in the BT when it will shine too!
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