Changing Caravans

Hi Guys,

We have no intention of touring on the bitumen.

Those that were at Copeton #1 might remember a 22' Boroma next to our van.

That Boroma was towed all over Australia including many of the outback tracks.

Those same people built a 24' Boroma that had everything you could possibly imagine and the TARE was 3200.

We are told that our 25' with Simplicity Suspension will probably have a TARE of 3300.

I am not going to get into a discussion of quality of build and the manner each van is put together; suffice it to say that they will both do 80+% of Australia and a BT will do the other 20% as well.

We are no longer interested in repeating the "other 20%" once we finish going across the top next year. We will certainly go off-road and park by a river or lake for an extended period of time as we will be similarly self-sufficient with water and electricity.

Cheers, Jay

Knowing you Jay, we at Bushtracker would have counted the 300-400 kg of details that you would want to add on, and so came up with a good figure. There is no way you figure for your new van is going to come in like that. Not in a "Blue Moon". I wish there was a betting parlour to put money on it, as I know I am right.

Now no disrespect to you Jay, I actually personally like you, but a little disclosure for the "Newbies" here is in Order. Jay barely got through with his Bushtracker van in the first place, we only JUST managed to get through 165+ emails of some impossible details and way too long of many paged discussions. At one point we pulled the pin because we just thought it all a bit waaaaaay too much. In truth, we would have to have a full Office Staff Meeting to decide if we even WOULD be willing to build Jay a 25' Bushtracker. He would well know this, and that is probably one of the underlying reasons of the change and not doing the application to Bushtracker. This is the truth.

Jay, I personally like you, and do wish you well. I hope your transition to Boroma is a success. In all fairness to you, I think you will have learned some valuable lessons that you can apply in your new endeavour. Good luck with it.

To all other Newbies, I think an honest disclosure here is valid. Jay, there is no way you are going to come in at the projected weight you are talking without some major changes to your style... Unless a special very light road running version, without our level of gear, and without the 200 little added bits of detail you are going to want to put on; and I really doubt that is what you are after: That projection is totally unreasonable, and you know we speak from experience.

In all fairness, I don't want any Newbies to get off the Track here, understand the underlying foundation...

Jay, Best Regards, Ranger...

Brian, thanks for the kind thoughts.

Also thanks for confirming what I thought to be the case under our Consitution - once a BOG always a BOG.

2008 will find us in the USA; 2009 is a good bet for us to attend the rally and compare vans.

This is not about one van being better than the other; this is about wanting a different style/interior to fit our new life style. Having been in our friend's Boromas, we like the interior look produced by Boroma.

The owners/builders of Boroma have given us an aproximate weight estimate that meets our requirements; Steve's comments make it clear that he believes the van will be much heavier. As also said, everyone is entitled to their opinion without attacking the other person for having a different opinion.

For the record the sole reason we did not ask BT to build our new van is that we were advised that Conrad had requested a shower in his 27' BT and his request was declined. This is my understanding; I could be wrong; I am glad that Steve has gone on record that he will build a separate shower when requested.

Our 21' BT has a TARE of 2900kg. Boroma estimates that each foot of standard construction is approx 110kg. A 25' Boroma includes the front built-in boot in its stated length. That translates to approximately 23 1/2 internally.

Steve indicated that BTs overall weigh less than Boromas. Therefore, assuming that a BT is also aprox 110kg per foot or less, a 24' BT should weigh approx 3230kg. This has been my assumption.

Brian, I am advised that BT will build a 24' on a double axle.

As I said in the initial post: we LOVE our BT.

If BT now builds a separate shower (entered either separately or through the ensuite) and we could have a 24' double axle BT with a TARE of around 3300-3400 I would certainly consider building a BT since as Steve indicated it would cost less than a Boroma.

Brian, as a result of Steve's positive comments about weight and cost of a BT as compared to a Boroma, and a separate shower as well (!), I will send a copy of our proposed plans and construction notes to BT to obtain a weight estimate and a cost estimate for comparison.

Newbies:

1. They are both great vans. If you are going to Cape York with your van or across the country and do not want to hesitate to go on any particular road and you are driving an F-truck - buy a BT!

2. If you are driving any other vehicle, for safety sake and to make sure you are always "weight" legal, probably 19' is the largest BT you should tow. Again, that is just my opinion; there are lots of non-F-Trucks towing larger BTs.

Ain't it fun - life rocks on the road!

Jay

Jay, now trust me, I am not trying to get the business... You know what I mean... What I have to say is "Fair Dinkum" not commercial. This is just for anyone else as well... Look, at all of the Shows we have been to, I have never even seen a Boroma that went 110 kg a foot fully optioned up. They would have to be in a basic Standard Inclusions model and one never sighted by me..

Optional Equipment adds 300 to 400 kg.. Jay, your fine taste in exotic appointments in lifestyle? ..... Will add another 300 to 400 kg.. Now, at least you are in the ball park. I want you to be realistic in your expectations... Boroma is a very pretty van, and I often tell Clients that I think it is one of the best built on road vans out there, albeit also the most expensive. I only want people to compare apples to apples and see how the respective vans are built, to know for themselves what and why; and to operate with all of the information.

As to the separate toilets and showers, we are always improving designs and finish and incorporating new ideas into layouts. I still think it is a bit of a waste of space for a wet seat that can be accomplished with a simple cover for the loo..... After trying to show the alternatives if they still want it, no problem. We can, and do, do it. We do not specialise in "Tizzy" preferring to give a long lasting quality finish, a little spartan for some Interior Design "Artsy" type people, but they can "Jazz" it all they want.. We are moving towards some oval shaped yacht style lounges in leather and things to try and make everyones taste buds happy. But long life and value is what we aim for, and from reports we get from Customers we still have the highest resale value of any van in Australia. I would like to think there is a reason for that..

Ranger, trying to do the right thing by everyone is my goal.